1 00:00:05,189 --> 00:00:07,293 Here's the first question. 2 00:00:07,293 --> 00:00:09,135 "I have a question about giving. 3 00:00:09,135 --> 00:00:10,949 I will use myself as an example, 4 00:00:10,949 --> 00:00:13,155 but the question can be taken more generally. 5 00:00:13,155 --> 00:00:14,944 What is a good attitude to have 6 00:00:14,944 --> 00:00:17,282 when it comes to giving? 7 00:00:17,282 --> 00:00:18,952 When it comes to church, charity, 8 00:00:18,952 --> 00:00:21,121 supporting ministry efforts, 9 00:00:21,121 --> 00:00:23,164 or missions, etc., 10 00:00:23,164 --> 00:00:26,257 but you also have debt? 11 00:00:26,257 --> 00:00:32,733 We are about $400 behind on the rent. 12 00:00:32,733 --> 00:00:35,726 And it will take months of small, 13 00:00:35,726 --> 00:00:38,135 affordable payments here and there 14 00:00:38,135 --> 00:00:40,916 to pay it off while staying afloat. 15 00:00:40,916 --> 00:00:44,357 I recently became a Christian..." 16 00:00:44,357 --> 00:00:46,653 You see these different factors here. 17 00:00:46,653 --> 00:00:48,203 You see the kind of debt - 18 00:00:48,203 --> 00:00:49,933 that's something that we might want 19 00:00:49,933 --> 00:00:51,617 to give consideration to. 20 00:00:51,617 --> 00:00:52,753 The kind of debt. 21 00:00:52,753 --> 00:00:55,021 He's a brand new Christian. 22 00:00:55,021 --> 00:00:56,694 A brand new Christian is probably 23 00:00:56,694 --> 00:00:57,904 going to look different 24 00:00:57,904 --> 00:00:58,810 than someone who is 25 00:00:58,810 --> 00:01:00,262 more of a seasoned Christian, 26 00:01:00,262 --> 00:01:02,269 or walked with the Lord longer anyway. 27 00:01:02,269 --> 00:01:05,301 Because you recognize as I recognize, 28 00:01:05,301 --> 00:01:06,804 when I first got saved, 29 00:01:06,804 --> 00:01:08,765 I had a mess of debt. 30 00:01:08,765 --> 00:01:13,127 The financial situation of lots of lost people 31 00:01:13,127 --> 00:01:14,561 is just a wreck. 32 00:01:14,561 --> 00:01:16,060 And then you get saved, 33 00:01:16,060 --> 00:01:18,230 and oh, now you have to start 34 00:01:18,230 --> 00:01:22,507 putting pieces in place. 35 00:01:22,507 --> 00:01:26,278 So, "...I recently became a Christian 36 00:01:26,278 --> 00:01:27,867 and acknowledged truths 37 00:01:27,867 --> 00:01:29,952 like not storing up treasure on earth, 38 00:01:29,952 --> 00:01:32,103 not being anxious for tomorrow, 39 00:01:32,103 --> 00:01:33,423 not idolizing your money 40 00:01:33,423 --> 00:01:34,582 or trusting in riches, 41 00:01:34,582 --> 00:01:36,779 trusting in God as a provider, etc. 42 00:01:36,779 --> 00:01:40,276 And I do not think giving is optional. 43 00:01:40,276 --> 00:01:42,072 Well, as a Christian, it is something 44 00:01:42,072 --> 00:01:43,261 you want to practice. 45 00:01:43,261 --> 00:01:44,631 You want to be able to give. 46 00:01:44,631 --> 00:01:46,884 And I think there's a text 47 00:01:46,884 --> 00:01:49,215 which says God provides or increases 48 00:01:49,215 --> 00:01:52,150 in order that we may be able to give more. 49 00:01:52,150 --> 00:01:54,202 So with these in mind, 50 00:01:54,202 --> 00:01:55,742 what is a good attitude to have 51 00:01:55,742 --> 00:01:58,571 considering your debts when giving. 52 00:01:58,571 --> 00:02:00,706 Should you give a small amount? 53 00:02:00,706 --> 00:02:03,586 Or does that show a lack of faith in God 54 00:02:03,586 --> 00:02:05,499 to provide from His own hand? 55 00:02:05,499 --> 00:02:09,197 Does that show more of a self-trust? 56 00:02:09,197 --> 00:02:12,680 Or should you give as you would like to give, 57 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:14,803 as if you did have the means, 58 00:02:14,803 --> 00:02:19,032 trusting in Him for your financial situation. 59 00:02:19,032 --> 00:02:21,563 Or is that a lack of wisdom 60 00:02:21,563 --> 00:02:22,997 and lack of stewardship 61 00:02:22,997 --> 00:02:25,163 for your wife and kids? 62 00:02:25,163 --> 00:02:29,472 I've heard you say that as a church 63 00:02:29,472 --> 00:02:33,170 you have tried to intend to give more 64 00:02:33,170 --> 00:02:36,919 than your abilities as a matter of faith. 65 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:38,847 Is this is wise or biblical concerning 66 00:02:38,847 --> 00:02:42,063 your home and family as well? 67 00:02:42,063 --> 00:02:44,495 Can you shed some light on the issue? 68 00:02:44,495 --> 00:02:46,722 Thanks." 69 00:02:46,722 --> 00:02:55,753 So, what principles do you think? 70 00:02:55,753 --> 00:02:57,714 That guy came to you 71 00:02:57,714 --> 00:03:02,348 and asked you about your thoughts on this. 72 00:03:02,348 --> 00:03:08,562 What are your thoughts? 73 00:03:08,562 --> 00:03:11,584 I mean, the Scriptures speak a ton about money. 74 00:03:11,584 --> 00:03:20,467 And so, what do you say? 75 00:03:20,467 --> 00:03:23,738 And this is real. 76 00:03:23,738 --> 00:03:26,234 I have had people come to me repeatedly 77 00:03:26,234 --> 00:03:30,126 who say, I'm in debt, 78 00:03:30,126 --> 00:03:32,379 I want to give, 79 00:03:32,379 --> 00:03:34,468 where do I draw the line? 80 00:03:34,468 --> 00:03:36,181 How do I balance that? 81 00:03:36,181 --> 00:03:37,951 What do I do? 82 00:03:37,951 --> 00:03:39,799 What's the best approach? 83 00:03:39,799 --> 00:03:45,172 Should I, one, continue to give 84 00:03:45,172 --> 00:03:47,769 generously? 85 00:03:47,769 --> 00:03:49,995 And trust the Lord? 86 00:03:49,995 --> 00:03:53,585 Or, should I basically put my giving, 87 00:03:53,585 --> 00:03:55,322 either totally on hold 88 00:03:55,322 --> 00:03:59,129 or reduce it significantly 89 00:03:59,129 --> 00:04:01,309 and attack this debt over here? 90 00:04:01,309 --> 00:04:03,955 What is the most God honoring way? 91 00:04:03,955 --> 00:04:05,646 That's really the issue here. 92 00:04:05,646 --> 00:04:15,647 What is the most God honoring way? 93 00:04:15,647 --> 00:04:18,307 What do you think? 94 00:04:18,307 --> 00:04:20,295 Any thoughts? 95 00:04:20,295 --> 00:04:21,516 (from the room) 96 00:04:21,516 --> 00:04:24,621 Would it be to pay off the debt first, 97 00:04:24,621 --> 00:04:27,142 and then to be freed from that debt, 98 00:04:27,142 --> 00:04:28,410 so you wouldn't be 99 00:04:28,410 --> 00:04:30,773 like a slave to the lender? 100 00:04:30,773 --> 00:04:33,156 Tim: OK, now there's a verse coming up 101 00:04:33,156 --> 00:04:34,426 right there. 102 00:04:34,426 --> 00:04:36,090 A slave to the lender. 103 00:04:36,090 --> 00:04:40,093 The borrower is servant or a slave 104 00:04:40,093 --> 00:04:42,068 to the lender. 105 00:04:42,068 --> 00:04:43,625 OK. 106 00:04:43,625 --> 00:04:46,551 Now that's a reality. 107 00:04:46,551 --> 00:04:48,059 You know, one of the things 108 00:04:48,059 --> 00:04:51,706 that could come up in a conversation like this 109 00:04:51,706 --> 00:04:54,171 is whether debt is even permissible 110 00:04:54,171 --> 00:04:55,492 to the Christian. 111 00:04:55,492 --> 00:04:58,676 But, if you get saved and you already have debt, 112 00:04:58,676 --> 00:05:00,217 and you don't have the ability 113 00:05:00,217 --> 00:05:02,046 to pay it off immediately, 114 00:05:02,046 --> 00:05:04,292 you're obviously in a situation 115 00:05:04,292 --> 00:05:05,772 that you have to deal with. 116 00:05:05,772 --> 00:05:07,639 Whatever your convictions are 117 00:05:07,639 --> 00:05:09,498 concerning whether a Christian ought 118 00:05:09,498 --> 00:05:11,196 to get further in debt, 119 00:05:11,196 --> 00:05:12,988 or whether it's permissible for a Christian 120 00:05:12,988 --> 00:05:15,495 to take out wise debt? 121 00:05:15,495 --> 00:05:17,508 Or a business loan? 122 00:05:17,508 --> 00:05:20,631 Or what exactly is forbidden in Scripture? 123 00:05:20,631 --> 00:05:22,707 What is permitted in Scripture? 124 00:05:22,707 --> 00:05:25,420 Some people would go to Romans 125 00:05:25,420 --> 00:05:28,634 and basically say, 126 00:05:28,634 --> 00:05:32,408 well, owe no man anything, 127 00:05:32,408 --> 00:05:34,687 except love. 128 00:05:34,687 --> 00:05:37,741 And so, if I'm not to owe any man anything 129 00:05:37,741 --> 00:05:45,355 then I'm not supposed to borrow money. 130 00:05:45,355 --> 00:05:48,610 Which Mueller basically took that approach 131 00:05:48,610 --> 00:05:50,649 and interpreted that passage that way. 132 00:05:50,649 --> 00:05:52,340 And I believe Hudson Taylor, 133 00:05:52,340 --> 00:05:54,365 kind of following Mueller's lead, 134 00:05:54,365 --> 00:05:58,661 was minded that way as well. 135 00:05:58,661 --> 00:06:02,111 I honestly - although those two men 136 00:06:02,111 --> 00:06:07,047 have been really significant in my own life 137 00:06:07,047 --> 00:06:08,455 as far as debt 138 00:06:08,455 --> 00:06:10,327 and as far as trusting God, 139 00:06:10,327 --> 00:06:16,044 I don't believe that they're exactly 140 00:06:16,044 --> 00:06:18,195 dealing with that text in Romans 13 141 00:06:18,195 --> 00:06:22,488 exactly right. 142 00:06:22,488 --> 00:06:25,508 But, I think that you could 143 00:06:25,508 --> 00:06:29,408 make a case for the fact - 144 00:06:29,408 --> 00:06:33,524 I would say from a stewardship standpoint, 145 00:06:33,524 --> 00:06:36,177 if I'm faced with a situation 146 00:06:36,177 --> 00:06:39,256 where I can take out a mortgage 147 00:06:39,256 --> 00:06:41,150 for a house, 148 00:06:41,150 --> 00:06:44,358 and be actually paying for the house, 149 00:06:44,358 --> 00:06:47,947 and it would cost me just the same to rent, 150 00:06:47,947 --> 00:06:52,213 but fifteen years down the road, 151 00:06:52,213 --> 00:06:56,610 the house is paid for, 152 00:06:56,610 --> 00:06:58,904 if I'm on a fifteen year mortgage. 153 00:06:58,904 --> 00:07:03,865 And if I'm renting, I have to go on renting. 154 00:07:03,865 --> 00:07:06,508 To me, the stewardship there, 155 00:07:06,508 --> 00:07:08,367 the wisdom is over here. 156 00:07:08,367 --> 00:07:09,695 And the thing is, 157 00:07:09,695 --> 00:07:14,673 it's not an unwise type of unsecured debt 158 00:07:14,673 --> 00:07:16,459 like a student loan. 159 00:07:16,459 --> 00:07:19,854 Student loans are horrible debt. 160 00:07:19,854 --> 00:07:21,463 Horrible debt. 161 00:07:21,463 --> 00:07:24,648 Because you've got no asset. 162 00:07:24,648 --> 00:07:26,512 And so what happens if you 163 00:07:26,512 --> 00:07:27,809 drop out of school 164 00:07:27,809 --> 00:07:29,215 and you don't end up getting 165 00:07:29,215 --> 00:07:30,971 a high paying job? 166 00:07:30,971 --> 00:07:33,091 You're wracked with all this debt. 167 00:07:33,091 --> 00:07:35,008 You've got nothing to show for it. 168 00:07:35,008 --> 00:07:37,189 It's unsecured. 169 00:07:37,189 --> 00:07:39,064 And it's just a mess. 170 00:07:39,064 --> 00:07:41,225 I would never, never advise 171 00:07:41,225 --> 00:07:42,749 people to take out that. 172 00:07:42,749 --> 00:07:44,174 But as far as a mortgage, 173 00:07:44,174 --> 00:07:45,278 you do have an asset. 174 00:07:45,278 --> 00:07:46,916 You have the home. 175 00:07:46,916 --> 00:07:49,158 If the bank has to foreclose, 176 00:07:49,158 --> 00:07:51,788 they're able to repossess your home. 177 00:07:51,788 --> 00:07:53,879 They at least have that asset 178 00:07:53,879 --> 00:07:55,526 that you borrowed the money on. 179 00:07:55,526 --> 00:07:57,530 And so even if you can't pay them back, 180 00:07:57,530 --> 00:07:59,890 they get the house back. 181 00:07:59,890 --> 00:08:01,982 You know my take - 182 00:08:01,982 --> 00:08:04,440 I think loans on cars are 183 00:08:04,440 --> 00:08:09,660 absolutely bad, bad stewardship. 184 00:08:09,660 --> 00:08:16,061 But, anyway, that's my take. 185 00:08:16,061 --> 00:08:16,815 (from the room) 186 00:08:16,815 --> 00:08:18,401 So what about all the people here 187 00:08:18,401 --> 00:08:20,065 who have student loans? 188 00:08:20,065 --> 00:08:22,502 Tim: Well, here's the thing. 189 00:08:22,502 --> 00:08:24,363 I had student loans. 190 00:08:24,363 --> 00:08:26,543 I didn't need them for school. 191 00:08:26,543 --> 00:08:29,243 I took them out to buy cars and motorcycles. 192 00:08:29,243 --> 00:08:31,603 But see, the thing was, I was lost. 193 00:08:31,603 --> 00:08:35,591 And I think what we're doing is 194 00:08:35,591 --> 00:08:37,227 we're dealing with a man here 195 00:08:37,227 --> 00:08:38,885 much like many of us. 196 00:08:38,885 --> 00:08:40,534 We wake up one day, 197 00:08:40,534 --> 00:08:41,920 our eyes are opened, 198 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:43,610 God has saved us, 199 00:08:43,610 --> 00:08:46,131 and now we look at our situation 200 00:08:46,131 --> 00:08:49,446 and we recognize... Oh. 201 00:08:49,446 --> 00:08:51,638 Scripture definitely has something to say 202 00:08:51,638 --> 00:08:53,050 about debt. 203 00:08:53,050 --> 00:08:55,656 The borrower is servant to the lender. 204 00:08:55,656 --> 00:08:57,185 That doesn't necessarily mean 205 00:08:57,185 --> 00:08:58,785 it's absolutely forbidden, 206 00:08:58,785 --> 00:09:00,236 but that's a reality. 207 00:09:00,236 --> 00:09:01,743 And that is a reality 208 00:09:01,743 --> 00:09:04,045 that as long as you're in debt, 209 00:09:04,045 --> 00:09:05,648 you don't have the freedom. 210 00:09:05,648 --> 00:09:07,451 Why? Because you're a slave. 211 00:09:07,451 --> 00:09:09,262 You don't have the freedom 212 00:09:09,262 --> 00:09:11,137 that you would otherwise have. 213 00:09:11,137 --> 00:09:13,264 Oh, there's nothing like being out of debt. 214 00:09:13,264 --> 00:09:14,775 Everything is paid for. 215 00:09:14,775 --> 00:09:18,753 Because there's a freedom in that. 216 00:09:18,753 --> 00:09:23,087 But, OK, let's say it's desirable. 217 00:09:23,087 --> 00:09:25,463 But does that undo the fact 218 00:09:25,463 --> 00:09:28,151 that we have consistent commandments 219 00:09:28,151 --> 00:09:33,495 in Scripture to give? 220 00:09:33,495 --> 00:09:38,782 Anybody throw some verses out? 221 00:09:38,782 --> 00:09:41,723 Or be able to quote some passages 222 00:09:41,723 --> 00:09:54,009 that have to do with giving? 223 00:09:54,009 --> 00:09:57,323 One of my favorites as a young believer 224 00:09:57,323 --> 00:10:01,280 was the one found in Luke 6. 225 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:04,097 Give, and it shall be given to you, 226 00:10:04,097 --> 00:10:05,422 pressed down, 227 00:10:05,422 --> 00:10:08,523 shaken together, 228 00:10:08,523 --> 00:10:09,876 and overflowing. 229 00:10:09,876 --> 00:10:11,312 Now if you think about 230 00:10:11,312 --> 00:10:13,916 putting something - 231 00:10:13,916 --> 00:10:15,264 you know, you put gravel 232 00:10:15,264 --> 00:10:17,857 or wheat or corn or whatever - 233 00:10:17,857 --> 00:10:20,604 it's the idea that you put it in a basket 234 00:10:20,604 --> 00:10:22,197 and you shake it. 235 00:10:22,197 --> 00:10:24,265 When you shake it, it settles. 236 00:10:24,265 --> 00:10:25,815 And it's not just shaken 237 00:10:25,815 --> 00:10:27,342 so that there's no air 238 00:10:27,342 --> 00:10:29,239 or the least amount of air in there. 239 00:10:29,239 --> 00:10:33,604 But it's actually pressed down. 240 00:10:33,604 --> 00:10:36,459 It's the idea you shake it together, 241 00:10:36,459 --> 00:10:37,949 you press it down, 242 00:10:37,949 --> 00:10:39,719 and then you just keep filling it 243 00:10:39,719 --> 00:10:41,089 until it's overflowing. 244 00:10:41,089 --> 00:10:42,991 That is a promise. 245 00:10:42,991 --> 00:10:45,333 So here's the thing, 246 00:10:45,333 --> 00:10:48,004 if I've got a promise in Scripture 247 00:10:48,004 --> 00:10:50,811 that if I give, it's going to be given to me 248 00:10:50,811 --> 00:10:52,122 in abundance - 249 00:10:52,122 --> 00:10:57,621 "Shall men give into your lap." 250 00:10:57,621 --> 00:10:59,840 What's that mean? 251 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:01,133 Well, it means that God is 252 00:11:01,133 --> 00:11:04,608 going to give you favor with people. 253 00:11:04,608 --> 00:11:06,893 Now, even though I am not one 254 00:11:06,893 --> 00:11:10,491 to advocate Old Testament tithing, 255 00:11:10,491 --> 00:11:12,461 because I don't think the New Testament 256 00:11:12,461 --> 00:11:13,796 does that. 257 00:11:13,796 --> 00:11:16,655 But I am one to advocate the principle 258 00:11:16,655 --> 00:11:18,616 behind the tithing. 259 00:11:18,616 --> 00:11:20,672 Remember what God said to Israel? 260 00:11:20,672 --> 00:11:24,940 He said, "test Me." 261 00:11:24,940 --> 00:11:29,571 Here's the thing, if I'm in debt - 262 00:11:29,571 --> 00:11:31,037 because I was here. 263 00:11:31,037 --> 00:11:31,891 I was here. 264 00:11:31,891 --> 00:11:33,151 When I first got saved, 265 00:11:33,151 --> 00:11:34,535 I had that tension between, 266 00:11:34,535 --> 00:11:36,155 OK, I'm in debt, 267 00:11:36,155 --> 00:11:38,077 and I want to give. 268 00:11:38,077 --> 00:11:39,807 And then I got out of debt. 269 00:11:39,807 --> 00:11:41,343 But then I got back into debt 270 00:11:41,343 --> 00:11:43,361 with this house. 271 00:11:43,361 --> 00:11:44,820 And I wanted it paid off. 272 00:11:44,820 --> 00:11:47,027 We paid it off in six years. 273 00:11:47,027 --> 00:11:48,364 But let me tell you, 274 00:11:48,364 --> 00:11:49,824 during that six years, 275 00:11:49,824 --> 00:11:56,715 Ruby and I did not reduce our giving. 276 00:11:56,715 --> 00:11:59,141 And the thing was, 277 00:11:59,141 --> 00:12:02,937 I remember a time when we literally 278 00:12:02,937 --> 00:12:05,329 could go around our house 279 00:12:05,329 --> 00:12:09,109 and say that sofa - so-and-so gave it to us. 280 00:12:09,109 --> 00:12:11,474 That end table - so-and-so gave it to us. 281 00:12:11,474 --> 00:12:12,716 That thing over there - 282 00:12:12,716 --> 00:12:13,827 somebody gave us that. 283 00:12:13,827 --> 00:12:14,884 That lamp over there. 284 00:12:14,884 --> 00:12:16,370 These lamps right here. 285 00:12:16,370 --> 00:12:17,616 These plants right here. 286 00:12:17,616 --> 00:12:18,827 There was a time we could 287 00:12:18,827 --> 00:12:20,676 basically go around all of our stuff - 288 00:12:20,676 --> 00:12:23,164 those bookshelves over there, that dining room table, 289 00:12:23,164 --> 00:12:25,098 those chairs there... 290 00:12:25,098 --> 00:12:27,424 people gave all those things to us. 291 00:12:27,424 --> 00:12:30,899 Or God brought them to us some way. 292 00:12:30,899 --> 00:12:34,981 We had this GE refrigerator - 293 00:12:34,981 --> 00:12:37,630 Sid was just talking about the fact 294 00:12:37,630 --> 00:12:40,059 that Ruby and I were the first ones 295 00:12:40,059 --> 00:12:41,649 to buy a mobile home from them. 296 00:12:41,649 --> 00:12:43,137 Before we lived in this house, 297 00:12:43,137 --> 00:12:44,268 we bought a mobile home 298 00:12:44,268 --> 00:12:45,424 from Alamo Homes. 299 00:12:45,424 --> 00:12:47,807 And I remember, 300 00:12:47,807 --> 00:12:52,263 I got a free refrigerator thrown in - 301 00:12:52,263 --> 00:12:54,459 GE refrigerator - 302 00:12:54,459 --> 00:12:57,601 That thing lasted. 303 00:12:57,601 --> 00:12:59,222 We brought it here. 304 00:12:59,222 --> 00:13:01,320 It lasted a long time. 305 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:03,288 It just kept going and going 306 00:13:03,288 --> 00:13:07,725 and going and going and going. 307 00:13:07,725 --> 00:13:10,212 The thing I'm pointing at is this, 308 00:13:10,212 --> 00:13:13,522 that I don't think it's either/or. 309 00:13:13,522 --> 00:13:15,804 And with all the promises that are 310 00:13:15,804 --> 00:13:17,330 attached to giving, 311 00:13:17,330 --> 00:13:18,705 don't let the charismatics 312 00:13:18,705 --> 00:13:21,646 and the health/wealth prosperity people 313 00:13:21,646 --> 00:13:24,571 dull these promises 314 00:13:24,571 --> 00:13:26,270 in your own mind. 315 00:13:26,270 --> 00:13:28,610 God is faithful. 316 00:13:28,610 --> 00:13:30,677 And you know, 317 00:13:30,677 --> 00:13:32,442 there's the one that scatters 318 00:13:32,442 --> 00:13:33,929 and he all the more increases. 319 00:13:33,929 --> 00:13:35,660 And there's the one that holds back 320 00:13:35,660 --> 00:13:37,336 what he shouldn't hold back, 321 00:13:37,336 --> 00:13:39,535 and it only tends to poverty. 322 00:13:39,535 --> 00:13:41,914 I love that proverb too. 323 00:13:41,914 --> 00:13:43,805 Because I lived on those things. 324 00:13:43,805 --> 00:13:46,827 I lived on the promises of Isaiah 58. 325 00:13:46,827 --> 00:13:48,140 You're helping people 326 00:13:48,140 --> 00:13:49,816 and you're giving to people. 327 00:13:49,816 --> 00:13:52,265 And I think the thing that you want to do 328 00:13:52,265 --> 00:13:54,502 if you're in the place like this guy, 329 00:13:54,502 --> 00:13:56,714 is you want to do both. 330 00:13:56,714 --> 00:14:00,042 It's not an either/or. 331 00:14:00,042 --> 00:14:02,954 You want to test God - 332 00:14:02,954 --> 00:14:07,349 you don't want to be foolish. 333 00:14:07,349 --> 00:14:10,901 You want to do what you do prayerfully. 334 00:14:10,901 --> 00:14:13,241 You don't want to just run out and do something 335 00:14:13,241 --> 00:14:14,630 because Mueller did it. 336 00:14:14,630 --> 00:14:16,254 But you know what you want to do, 337 00:14:16,254 --> 00:14:18,077 you want to study the promises of God 338 00:14:18,077 --> 00:14:19,617 and you want to act in faith. 339 00:14:19,617 --> 00:14:20,820 Prayerfully act in faith. 340 00:14:20,820 --> 00:14:22,926 And I'm not going to say that there's one 341 00:14:22,926 --> 00:14:27,563 specific way to do it. 342 00:14:27,563 --> 00:14:30,458 I remember, and I've told this story before, 343 00:14:30,458 --> 00:14:31,894 but it's always stuck with me. 344 00:14:31,894 --> 00:14:33,914 My pastor out at Community Baptist Church, 345 00:14:33,914 --> 00:14:35,541 Pat Horner, 346 00:14:35,541 --> 00:14:39,427 drove over to Houston to a conference. 347 00:14:39,427 --> 00:14:41,482 He got into Houston, 348 00:14:41,482 --> 00:14:45,262 his car was on E (empty), 349 00:14:45,262 --> 00:14:47,113 going to this conference. 350 00:14:47,113 --> 00:14:50,234 He's got $20 in his pocket. 351 00:14:50,234 --> 00:14:53,835 And that's his gas money to get home. 352 00:14:53,835 --> 00:14:56,791 And went he sat in this meeting, 353 00:14:56,791 --> 00:14:58,453 at the end of the meeting, 354 00:14:58,453 --> 00:15:00,096 they have a missionary go up 355 00:15:00,096 --> 00:15:03,829 and the pastor says this brother so-and-so 356 00:15:03,829 --> 00:15:06,759 is trying to get to whatever country it was, 357 00:15:06,759 --> 00:15:08,953 and they brought out one of those 5 gallon 358 00:15:08,953 --> 00:15:11,077 paint buckets and they set it down there 359 00:15:11,077 --> 00:15:15,092 and said can we help send this guy? 360 00:15:15,092 --> 00:15:16,308 Pat just felt led. 361 00:15:16,308 --> 00:15:18,155 He took the $20 out 362 00:15:18,155 --> 00:15:19,397 and he threw it in there. 363 00:15:19,397 --> 00:15:20,916 How was he going to get home? 364 00:15:20,916 --> 00:15:23,143 You see, he did that by faith. 365 00:15:23,143 --> 00:15:25,559 He did that by faith - it wasn't foolish. 366 00:15:25,559 --> 00:15:27,696 He felt led of the Lord to do it. 367 00:15:27,696 --> 00:15:30,937 He recognized that he wasn't 368 00:15:30,937 --> 00:15:34,711 going to be able to get back. 369 00:15:34,711 --> 00:15:36,827 And he said he threw the money in there, 370 00:15:36,827 --> 00:15:37,952 the service is over, 371 00:15:37,952 --> 00:15:39,869 and he said he was going down the aisle 372 00:15:39,869 --> 00:15:41,247 of the church building 373 00:15:41,247 --> 00:15:42,885 headed out the back door. 374 00:15:42,885 --> 00:15:48,303 He said a man that he had never met in his life 375 00:15:48,303 --> 00:15:50,229 came up to him, 376 00:15:50,229 --> 00:15:54,736 and put his hand on his 377 00:15:54,736 --> 00:15:57,579 and pressed $20 into it. 378 00:15:57,579 --> 00:16:01,611 And he told him, 379 00:16:01,611 --> 00:16:04,786 I have no idea why I'm giving this to you. 380 00:16:04,786 --> 00:16:08,915 The Lord just impressed it upon me. 381 00:16:08,915 --> 00:16:14,903 And you know, when the Lord does 382 00:16:14,903 --> 00:16:17,015 that kind of thing to you, 383 00:16:17,015 --> 00:16:23,160 that's amazing. 384 00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:27,156 You want that to happen more. 385 00:16:27,156 --> 00:16:28,959 Charles Leiter tells me 386 00:16:28,959 --> 00:16:32,547 about Keith McCloud. 387 00:16:32,547 --> 00:16:36,396 This brother would get himself into places 388 00:16:36,396 --> 00:16:40,643 where he wouldn't have gas. 389 00:16:40,643 --> 00:16:44,454 And he would drive all the way home 390 00:16:44,454 --> 00:16:48,374 on E (empty). 391 00:16:48,374 --> 00:16:52,721 We're talking hundreds of miles on E. 392 00:16:52,721 --> 00:16:56,907 And he just prayed the whole time. 393 00:16:56,907 --> 00:16:59,526 So, what's that? 394 00:16:59,526 --> 00:17:03,801 And Hudson Taylor, 395 00:17:03,801 --> 00:17:09,022 you probably know the story 396 00:17:09,022 --> 00:17:11,329 or you've heard somebody say it before, 397 00:17:11,329 --> 00:17:14,355 but he had a thousand missionaries 398 00:17:14,355 --> 00:17:16,088 in the China Inland Mission. 399 00:17:16,088 --> 00:17:18,063 But more than that, 400 00:17:18,063 --> 00:17:20,910 and he didn't have money to pay them. 401 00:17:20,910 --> 00:17:22,363 Many of them had wives, 402 00:17:22,363 --> 00:17:23,775 they had children. 403 00:17:23,775 --> 00:17:25,044 He didn't have any money. 404 00:17:25,044 --> 00:17:26,790 And one of the other missionaries 405 00:17:26,790 --> 00:17:29,828 saw him in his office just whistling. 406 00:17:29,828 --> 00:17:35,359 He loved that song that John Sytsma loves. 407 00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:38,400 Jesus, I am resting, resting... 408 00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:40,866 And he was whistling that song, 409 00:17:40,866 --> 00:17:42,468 and one of the missionaries 410 00:17:42,468 --> 00:17:44,242 was watching him and thought, 411 00:17:44,242 --> 00:17:46,263 are you for real? 412 00:17:46,263 --> 00:17:48,861 You've got all these missionaries at your care 413 00:17:48,861 --> 00:17:52,079 and no money's coming in. 414 00:17:52,079 --> 00:17:54,329 He said I've got a quarter in my pocket 415 00:17:54,329 --> 00:17:56,798 and all the promises of God. 416 00:17:56,798 --> 00:17:58,345 You see, that's the thing. 417 00:17:58,345 --> 00:18:01,440 If you've got promises that 418 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:04,890 if you scatter, you increase. 419 00:18:04,890 --> 00:18:08,267 If you hold back, it tends to poverty. 420 00:18:08,267 --> 00:18:11,579 Well, I can tell you which one is smart. 421 00:18:11,579 --> 00:18:16,824 (incomplete thought) 422 00:18:16,824 --> 00:18:18,291 It's kind of like the farmer. 423 00:18:18,291 --> 00:18:21,169 You know, if the farmer 424 00:18:21,169 --> 00:18:23,855 throws a lot out there, 425 00:18:23,855 --> 00:18:26,548 prospect for a good harvest. 426 00:18:26,548 --> 00:18:28,656 If he's really stingy in what he throws, 427 00:18:28,656 --> 00:18:30,413 he just throws a couple seeds, 428 00:18:30,413 --> 00:18:34,355 he just gets a couple stalks of wheat. 429 00:18:34,355 --> 00:18:37,376 All because he needs to hoard it. 430 00:18:37,376 --> 00:18:39,250 Gotta keep it. 431 00:18:39,250 --> 00:18:42,469 But see, that's the very principle of Scripture 432 00:18:42,469 --> 00:18:45,717 that we should scatter. 433 00:18:45,717 --> 00:18:49,078 Now, there's different kinds of debt. 434 00:18:49,078 --> 00:18:50,548 You know, it's one thing 435 00:18:50,548 --> 00:18:52,591 when I'm living in this house 436 00:18:52,591 --> 00:18:55,043 and I had a 20 year mortgage 437 00:18:55,043 --> 00:18:59,664 and I wanted to pay it off fast. 438 00:18:59,664 --> 00:19:01,856 That's different than 439 00:19:01,856 --> 00:19:07,147 he's $400 behind right now. 440 00:19:07,147 --> 00:19:11,595 So, that's kind of a different situation. 441 00:19:11,595 --> 00:19:15,810 He's in a position where 442 00:19:15,810 --> 00:19:19,586 he owes somebody money 443 00:19:19,586 --> 00:19:22,552 and it's past due. 444 00:19:22,552 --> 00:19:24,096 It's one thing to have debt 445 00:19:24,096 --> 00:19:25,234 where you owe people, 446 00:19:25,234 --> 00:19:27,223 but you're making your payments on time. 447 00:19:27,223 --> 00:19:29,970 It's another thing when you're behind. 448 00:19:29,970 --> 00:19:31,923 And I would make that a real priority. 449 00:19:31,923 --> 00:19:33,486 But see, I don't think that 450 00:19:33,486 --> 00:19:37,372 the only things in the equation 451 00:19:37,372 --> 00:19:41,086 are whether you give to the Lord 452 00:19:41,086 --> 00:19:44,428 or whether you pay your debt. 453 00:19:44,428 --> 00:19:45,988 The reason I'm saying that 454 00:19:45,988 --> 00:19:51,301 is because there's more money in our lives 455 00:19:51,301 --> 00:19:53,953 than just what we pay debt with 456 00:19:53,953 --> 00:19:56,891 and what we give with. 457 00:19:56,891 --> 00:19:58,349 He's got other bills. 458 00:19:58,349 --> 00:19:59,729 He's got mouths to feed. 459 00:19:59,729 --> 00:20:01,268 He talked about having children. 460 00:20:01,268 --> 00:20:04,200 There's other things happening. 461 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:08,727 There's gasoline that's being used. 462 00:20:08,727 --> 00:20:11,598 So what I would say to somebody 463 00:20:11,598 --> 00:20:16,060 is all the other money, 464 00:20:16,060 --> 00:20:18,359 there needs to be some real discipline. 465 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:22,623 There needs to be some real sacrifice. 466 00:20:22,623 --> 00:20:24,743 You know, you can get this tension 467 00:20:24,743 --> 00:20:25,995 where you're feeling like, 468 00:20:25,995 --> 00:20:27,598 oh, well I've got debt over here, 469 00:20:27,598 --> 00:20:29,372 but I also want to be able to give. 470 00:20:29,372 --> 00:20:31,438 But I think you need to give consideration 471 00:20:31,438 --> 00:20:32,657 to all the other money 472 00:20:32,657 --> 00:20:35,166 that's being used in your life. 473 00:20:35,166 --> 00:20:38,411 Like, if you're in that kind of situation, 474 00:20:38,411 --> 00:20:41,004 you would not be going out to eat. 475 00:20:41,004 --> 00:20:43,513 You would not be going to a movie. 476 00:20:43,513 --> 00:20:45,964 You would not be taking a vacation. 477 00:20:45,964 --> 00:20:49,330 You would not be using gas 478 00:20:49,330 --> 00:20:52,299 for things that are unnecessary. 479 00:20:52,299 --> 00:20:54,857 You basically have to make sacrifices. 480 00:20:54,857 --> 00:20:59,272 (Incomplete thought) 481 00:20:59,272 --> 00:21:02,029 Brethren, we had a family 482 00:21:02,029 --> 00:21:04,634 in the church years ago 483 00:21:04,634 --> 00:21:07,447 who came to our deacons 484 00:21:07,447 --> 00:21:10,096 because he couldn't make 485 00:21:10,096 --> 00:21:15,077 his mortgage payment. 486 00:21:15,077 --> 00:21:17,605 And a week before that, 487 00:21:17,605 --> 00:21:20,345 he took his wife to Dallas 488 00:21:20,345 --> 00:21:28,996 for their anniversary. 489 00:21:28,996 --> 00:21:32,736 See, and I don't know what the situation is here, 490 00:21:32,736 --> 00:21:34,279 but I'll tell you this, 491 00:21:34,279 --> 00:21:36,156 if you're $400 behind, 492 00:21:36,156 --> 00:21:45,711 I would give in very reserved fashion. 493 00:21:45,711 --> 00:21:47,823 I would not give liberally 494 00:21:47,823 --> 00:21:49,482 because I don't think it's right 495 00:21:49,482 --> 00:21:51,453 for you to go taking a bunch of money 496 00:21:51,453 --> 00:21:53,011 and putting it in the church box 497 00:21:53,011 --> 00:21:55,616 when you've got somebody out there 498 00:21:55,616 --> 00:21:59,119 that you owe money to. 499 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:01,014 If I was in his place, 500 00:22:01,014 --> 00:22:04,493 I would give 501 00:22:04,493 --> 00:22:11,049 and I would eat rice and beans. 502 00:22:11,049 --> 00:22:13,441 If you've got to turn the A/C off 503 00:22:13,441 --> 00:22:16,688 or put it at 82. 504 00:22:16,688 --> 00:22:18,413 We're not buying clothes. 505 00:22:18,413 --> 00:22:19,679 We're not buying new shoes 506 00:22:19,679 --> 00:22:22,404 for the children when school starts. 507 00:22:22,404 --> 00:22:24,169 None of that. 508 00:22:24,169 --> 00:22:25,791 You're not doing that. 509 00:22:25,791 --> 00:22:27,821 You've got to make sacrifices. 510 00:22:27,821 --> 00:22:32,234 But the other thing is income. 511 00:22:32,234 --> 00:22:33,740 You know, a man can work 512 00:22:33,740 --> 00:22:36,212 more than one job. 513 00:22:36,212 --> 00:22:38,361 My brother-in-law, I remember, 514 00:22:38,361 --> 00:22:40,305 when we were starting a family, 515 00:22:40,305 --> 00:22:42,347 my brother-in-law Rick had a family. 516 00:22:42,347 --> 00:22:43,870 He had three jobs. 517 00:22:43,870 --> 00:22:46,965 I remember it was rare that we would see him home, 518 00:22:46,965 --> 00:22:48,718 because he'd get up in the morning, 519 00:22:48,718 --> 00:22:49,931 he'd go to one job, 520 00:22:49,931 --> 00:22:50,783 he'd get off, 521 00:22:50,783 --> 00:22:52,251 he'd go to another job, 522 00:22:52,251 --> 00:22:54,397 he'd be coming in like at midnight 523 00:22:54,397 --> 00:22:56,159 from the 3rd job. 524 00:22:56,159 --> 00:22:58,948 Look, if you've got to work three jobs... 525 00:22:58,948 --> 00:23:01,503 Work is the way out of debt. 526 00:23:01,503 --> 00:23:03,890 Work is the way out of difficulties like this. 527 00:23:03,890 --> 00:23:05,606 Work and sacrifice. 528 00:23:05,606 --> 00:23:12,921 You can't live like the Joneses. 529 00:23:12,921 --> 00:23:17,726 Any other thoughts? 530 00:23:17,726 --> 00:23:20,265 (from the room) 531 00:23:20,265 --> 00:23:22,363 Do you think it would be wrong 532 00:23:22,363 --> 00:23:25,846 as far as how you would define giving - 533 00:23:25,846 --> 00:23:27,778 we could always think of giving 534 00:23:27,778 --> 00:23:30,363 as a monetary value. 535 00:23:30,363 --> 00:23:32,522 Would it be right for this guy, 536 00:23:32,522 --> 00:23:34,101 like I might not be able to give 537 00:23:34,101 --> 00:23:35,161 so much monetarily, 538 00:23:35,161 --> 00:23:37,010 but Lord, I want to be able to give 539 00:23:37,010 --> 00:23:39,143 in different ways, just to serve? 540 00:23:39,143 --> 00:23:40,905 Tim: Yeah, it might be that. 541 00:23:40,905 --> 00:23:44,076 It might be, you know what? 542 00:23:44,076 --> 00:23:46,715 I can't really give money right now, 543 00:23:46,715 --> 00:23:49,300 but I can go paint the church building. 544 00:23:49,300 --> 00:23:51,425 I can go mow the lawn. 545 00:23:51,425 --> 00:23:53,526 Yeah, it could be that kind of thing. 546 00:23:53,526 --> 00:23:56,429 There's lots of ways to give to people. 547 00:23:56,429 --> 00:23:58,442 And you know, in some societies 548 00:23:58,442 --> 00:24:01,143 where the giving might be - 549 00:24:01,143 --> 00:24:06,732 you hear about preachers that get a chicken. 550 00:24:06,732 --> 00:24:09,227 There are other things of value 551 00:24:09,227 --> 00:24:11,239 that we may have. 552 00:24:11,239 --> 00:24:12,800 It doesn't come down to just 553 00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:18,372 whether I'm able to put some bills in the box. 554 00:24:18,372 --> 00:24:20,633 Brethren, I think one thing that 555 00:24:20,633 --> 00:24:23,769 just needs to grip us. 556 00:24:23,769 --> 00:24:29,211 You know, if you look back 557 00:24:29,211 --> 00:24:35,577 at the kings of Judah. 558 00:24:35,577 --> 00:24:45,420 One of them went by the name of Amaziah. 559 00:24:45,420 --> 00:24:49,553 Amaziah - he was the one 560 00:24:49,553 --> 00:24:57,196 who took like a hundred talents of gold, 561 00:24:57,196 --> 00:25:02,184 and I believe he was going to battle 562 00:25:02,184 --> 00:25:05,810 against Ben Hadad of Assyria. 563 00:25:05,810 --> 00:25:11,152 And he paid a hundred talents of gold 564 00:25:11,152 --> 00:25:17,059 to another king to basically send mercenaries 565 00:25:17,059 --> 00:25:19,559 to join his own forces. 566 00:25:19,559 --> 00:25:24,747 And the prophet came to him and said, 567 00:25:24,747 --> 00:25:28,790 What are you doing? 568 00:25:28,790 --> 00:25:32,704 We have the Lord on our side. 569 00:25:32,704 --> 00:25:34,877 You don't need that. 570 00:25:34,877 --> 00:25:40,386 And the king had already given the money. 571 00:25:40,386 --> 00:25:41,693 What do I do about 572 00:25:41,693 --> 00:25:48,699 the hundred talents of gold? 573 00:25:48,699 --> 00:25:50,300 What do I do about that? 574 00:25:50,300 --> 00:25:53,033 And the prophet said, 575 00:25:53,033 --> 00:25:55,780 what's that? 576 00:25:55,780 --> 00:25:57,995 The Lord's able to give you much more 577 00:25:57,995 --> 00:26:01,215 if He wants to. 578 00:26:01,215 --> 00:26:02,746 There's a place in Haggai 579 00:26:02,746 --> 00:26:05,508 where it says 580 00:26:05,508 --> 00:26:09,872 the silver is Mine and the gold is Mine, 581 00:26:09,872 --> 00:26:11,731 saith the Lord. 582 00:26:11,731 --> 00:26:13,274 See, that's the thing that 583 00:26:13,274 --> 00:26:19,769 we really have to recognize. 584 00:26:19,769 --> 00:26:21,870 I could tell you stories 585 00:26:21,870 --> 00:26:23,827 about my own family 586 00:26:23,827 --> 00:26:25,593 and our finances 587 00:26:25,593 --> 00:26:28,953 and the church and its finances. 588 00:26:28,953 --> 00:26:30,759 And the stories that I've read 589 00:26:30,759 --> 00:26:33,897 about men that really impacted me 590 00:26:33,897 --> 00:26:35,193 in this area. 591 00:26:35,193 --> 00:26:39,576 Just the accounts, the testimony 592 00:26:39,576 --> 00:26:43,244 of God's faithfulness. 593 00:26:43,244 --> 00:26:45,323 It's all the Lord's. 594 00:26:45,323 --> 00:26:46,975 You have as much as you have 595 00:26:46,975 --> 00:26:48,357 because the Lord has determined 596 00:26:48,357 --> 00:26:50,144 for you to have exactly that much. 597 00:26:50,144 --> 00:26:52,882 He could make you more wealthy 598 00:26:52,882 --> 00:26:54,118 than Bill Gates, 599 00:26:54,118 --> 00:26:56,207 if that was His intention. 600 00:26:56,207 --> 00:26:59,110 He can do that. 601 00:26:59,110 --> 00:27:02,311 He has not forgotten His people. 602 00:27:02,311 --> 00:27:05,676 If you're in a situation 603 00:27:05,676 --> 00:27:08,643 where you give 604 00:27:08,643 --> 00:27:10,645 and you're seeking to test Him - 605 00:27:10,645 --> 00:27:13,065 not presumptuously, 606 00:27:13,065 --> 00:27:16,170 but faithfully - you're testing Him, 607 00:27:16,170 --> 00:27:19,065 because He says, "test Me," 608 00:27:19,065 --> 00:27:21,412 because He's given these promises. 609 00:27:21,412 --> 00:27:22,482 And you say, Lord, 610 00:27:22,482 --> 00:27:24,425 I'm going to trust these promises. 611 00:27:24,425 --> 00:27:26,310 You say that if I give, 612 00:27:26,310 --> 00:27:27,611 men will give to me 613 00:27:27,611 --> 00:27:28,567 into my lap. 614 00:27:28,567 --> 00:27:30,766 They will give pressed down, shaken together, 615 00:27:30,766 --> 00:27:31,695 and overflowing. 616 00:27:31,695 --> 00:27:35,533 I'm going to test You, Lord. 617 00:27:35,533 --> 00:27:37,702 Because I want to see Your faithfulness. 618 00:27:37,702 --> 00:27:39,577 I want to see You do this. 619 00:27:39,577 --> 00:27:40,809 There's a joy in giving. 620 00:27:40,809 --> 00:27:42,966 It's more blessed to give than to receive. 621 00:27:42,966 --> 00:27:47,655 And God will cause that to be the reality. 622 00:27:47,655 --> 00:27:50,513 But then, if you've given 623 00:27:50,513 --> 00:27:52,741 and then you're in a place of need. 624 00:27:52,741 --> 00:27:56,240 What better way to come before the Lord 625 00:27:56,240 --> 00:28:03,921 and say Lord, I've given, and... 626 00:28:03,921 --> 00:28:06,830 Repeatedly, I can come and say, 627 00:28:06,830 --> 00:28:17,565 Lord, I need money for whatever. 628 00:28:17,565 --> 00:28:20,809 Grace needs a vehicle. 629 00:28:20,809 --> 00:28:24,154 Or Joshua is going to go to college. 630 00:28:24,154 --> 00:28:26,637 Lord, if I'd taken the money that I've given 631 00:28:26,637 --> 00:28:30,383 and I basically - it would have 632 00:28:30,383 --> 00:28:32,184 put Joshua through school 633 00:28:32,184 --> 00:28:34,163 and we'd have a vehicle, 634 00:28:34,163 --> 00:28:36,243 but I didn't. 635 00:28:36,243 --> 00:28:43,201 I gave it, but now I'm in need. 636 00:28:43,201 --> 00:28:45,919 That's the perfect place to be. 637 00:28:45,919 --> 00:28:47,843 Because the Lord says 638 00:28:47,843 --> 00:28:50,467 that if you're pouring yourself out 639 00:28:50,467 --> 00:28:53,690 for the hungry - spiritually hungry - 640 00:28:53,690 --> 00:28:54,544 you're giving. 641 00:28:54,544 --> 00:28:56,010 People put money in that box. 642 00:28:56,010 --> 00:28:59,431 We're supporting missionaries. We're supporting the spread of the Gospel. 643 00:28:59,431 --> 00:29:00,953 We're supporting I'll Be Honest. 644 00:29:00,953 --> 00:29:02,708 We're supporting Bibles that go out. 645 00:29:02,708 --> 00:29:04,391 We're supporting all manner of 646 00:29:04,391 --> 00:29:06,442 different kinds of evangelistic outreaches 647 00:29:06,442 --> 00:29:08,032 and tracts, 648 00:29:08,032 --> 00:29:12,910 and supporting men who preach the Gospel. 649 00:29:12,910 --> 00:29:15,329 That's the greater hunger. 650 00:29:15,329 --> 00:29:18,492 And the promises there in Isaiah 58 651 00:29:18,492 --> 00:29:23,159 is when the merciful man cries out 652 00:29:23,159 --> 00:29:28,577 in need, God says, I'm going to say to that man, 653 00:29:28,577 --> 00:29:30,639 "Here I am." 654 00:29:30,639 --> 00:29:32,136 See, that's what happens. 655 00:29:32,136 --> 00:29:34,662 Lord, I have tried to be mindful 656 00:29:34,662 --> 00:29:36,621 when other people have been in need. 657 00:29:36,621 --> 00:29:38,333 And now I'm in need. 658 00:29:38,333 --> 00:29:40,126 See, there's a promise in Scripture 659 00:29:40,126 --> 00:29:43,823 that says God's going to say, "Here I am." 660 00:29:43,823 --> 00:29:45,249 It's like when you can say, 661 00:29:45,249 --> 00:29:47,537 Lord, I've got these needs now 662 00:29:47,537 --> 00:29:51,222 and You said - Lord, I've got it right here. 663 00:29:51,222 --> 00:29:55,215 You said that You would take care of me 664 00:29:55,215 --> 00:29:57,521 when I get into exactly this kind of situation. 665 00:29:57,521 --> 00:30:00,962 And what I have found out is He will. 666 00:30:00,962 --> 00:30:02,457 Every single time. 667 00:30:02,457 --> 00:30:04,335 And I've been able to say that 668 00:30:04,335 --> 00:30:05,763 about our church. 669 00:30:05,763 --> 00:30:07,170 Every single time. 670 00:30:07,170 --> 00:30:08,355 Every single need that our church 671 00:30:08,355 --> 00:30:10,727 has ever had. 672 00:30:10,727 --> 00:30:12,840 If there's been a financial need, 673 00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:14,409 the Lord has provided for it, 674 00:30:14,409 --> 00:30:16,067 every single time. 675 00:30:16,067 --> 00:30:18,032 There's no exceptions. 676 00:30:18,032 --> 00:30:28,620 He's been faithful every single time. 677 00:30:28,620 --> 00:30:30,338 Any other thoughts on that one? 678 00:30:30,338 --> 00:30:31,967 (from the room) 679 00:30:31,967 --> 00:30:33,699 Just another quick testimony. 680 00:30:33,699 --> 00:30:36,260 Robert Chapman - 681 00:30:36,260 --> 00:30:37,876 they were ready to leave 682 00:30:37,876 --> 00:30:41,816 a conference at the train station, 683 00:30:41,816 --> 00:30:42,905 but they had no money. 684 00:30:42,905 --> 00:30:44,783 Chapman had been given some money 685 00:30:44,783 --> 00:30:46,187 at the conference, 686 00:30:46,187 --> 00:30:47,523 but then almost immediately 687 00:30:47,523 --> 00:30:49,199 given it to someone who he felt 688 00:30:49,199 --> 00:30:50,693 needed it more. 689 00:30:50,693 --> 00:30:52,386 On the way to the railway station, 690 00:30:52,386 --> 00:30:53,919 Fisher reminded Chapman 691 00:30:53,919 --> 00:30:55,587 that they had no money. 692 00:30:55,587 --> 00:30:57,467 Mr. Chapman replied, 693 00:30:57,467 --> 00:30:59,490 "To whom does the money belong 694 00:30:59,490 --> 00:31:02,100 and the cattle upon a thousand hills?" 695 00:31:02,100 --> 00:31:03,799 When they reached the station, 696 00:31:03,799 --> 00:31:06,177 a man on an arriving train 697 00:31:06,177 --> 00:31:07,600 recognized Chapman. 698 00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:08,481 He hurried over, 699 00:31:08,481 --> 00:31:09,878 handed him a five pound note 700 00:31:09,878 --> 00:31:12,002 and said, "I've had this in my pocket 701 00:31:12,002 --> 00:31:14,562 for some time and I'm glad I met you." 702 00:31:14,562 --> 00:31:17,244 He then got back on his train which departed. 703 00:31:17,244 --> 00:31:20,256 After a moment, Chapman asked his companion, 704 00:31:20,256 --> 00:31:23,064 "To whom does the money belong?" 705 00:31:23,064 --> 00:31:24,654 Tim: And Hudson Taylor had 706 00:31:24,654 --> 00:31:26,568 a very similar situation. 707 00:31:26,568 --> 00:31:28,077 He was traveling the U.S. 708 00:31:28,077 --> 00:31:30,752 He was at a train station in St. Louis. 709 00:31:30,752 --> 00:31:34,116 Again, just like he was there whistling 710 00:31:34,116 --> 00:31:36,866 when he's got a thousand missionaries 711 00:31:36,866 --> 00:31:39,212 and nothing to pay those guys. 712 00:31:39,212 --> 00:31:43,343 Here he is standing in the line 713 00:31:43,343 --> 00:31:44,838 to get a ticket for the train, 714 00:31:44,838 --> 00:31:47,065 and he's got no money. 715 00:31:47,065 --> 00:31:51,234 And the guy ahead of him is getting agitated. 716 00:31:51,234 --> 00:31:53,395 He's feeling this conviction. 717 00:31:53,395 --> 00:31:58,015 You need to buy Hudson Taylor's 718 00:31:58,015 --> 00:32:00,652 train ticket. 719 00:32:00,652 --> 00:32:02,875 And so they get all the way up there, 720 00:32:02,875 --> 00:32:04,744 and the guy can't bear it any longer. 721 00:32:04,744 --> 00:32:06,395 So he turns around, 722 00:32:06,395 --> 00:32:08,032 and either he gave him the money 723 00:32:08,032 --> 00:32:10,752 or he said I'm going to buy your ticket. 724 00:32:10,752 --> 00:32:13,575 And then Taylor tells him 725 00:32:13,575 --> 00:32:14,930 I didn't have any money. 726 00:32:14,930 --> 00:32:17,071 And the guy was actually frustrated with him. 727 00:32:17,071 --> 00:32:20,820 What? You just stood there in this line? 728 00:32:20,820 --> 00:32:23,049 And you didn't say anything? 729 00:32:23,049 --> 00:32:24,867 That just proved the point. 730 00:32:24,867 --> 00:32:27,661 I don't have to say anything. 731 00:32:27,661 --> 00:32:30,666 Because God knows. 732 00:32:30,666 --> 00:32:35,550 Christina - have we not heard 733 00:32:35,550 --> 00:32:39,166 the report that came there from China? 734 00:32:39,166 --> 00:32:41,897 She didn't have the money for rent 735 00:32:41,897 --> 00:32:45,451 and a lost - listen - 736 00:32:45,451 --> 00:32:49,742 the Chinese - I'm not saying Americans are much better, 737 00:32:49,742 --> 00:32:51,920 but different countries kind of 738 00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:53,982 have their different sins. 739 00:32:53,982 --> 00:32:55,997 But if there's something that the Chinese are, 740 00:32:55,997 --> 00:32:58,511 they are cold; they are heartless. 741 00:32:58,511 --> 00:33:02,014 They are not a merciful people. 742 00:33:02,014 --> 00:33:04,896 And here is this lost neighbor 743 00:33:04,896 --> 00:33:08,637 who comes and gives Christina 744 00:33:08,637 --> 00:33:10,227 a large sum of money, 745 00:33:10,227 --> 00:33:12,103 and the exact amount that was needed 746 00:33:12,103 --> 00:33:14,850 to pay the rent that she couldn't pay. 747 00:33:14,850 --> 00:33:17,922 That's the kind of thing that happens. 748 00:33:17,922 --> 00:33:19,556 I remember reading the story 749 00:33:19,556 --> 00:33:21,259 about a widow, 750 00:33:21,259 --> 00:33:23,198 and she didn't have any food, 751 00:33:23,198 --> 00:33:25,681 and she lived in an apartment complex, 752 00:33:25,681 --> 00:33:29,156 and some really wicked man 753 00:33:29,156 --> 00:33:33,858 came and left - he felt prompted - 754 00:33:33,858 --> 00:33:36,556 and he left a bag of groceries there. 755 00:33:36,556 --> 00:33:38,187 He could hear the woman, 756 00:33:38,187 --> 00:33:39,390 either through the wall 757 00:33:39,390 --> 00:33:40,404 or through the window 758 00:33:40,404 --> 00:33:41,703 praising the Lord. 759 00:33:41,703 --> 00:33:43,236 And he couldn't bear that 760 00:33:43,236 --> 00:33:46,563 and he had to tell her 761 00:33:46,563 --> 00:33:49,025 that God didn't bring you those groceries. 762 00:33:49,025 --> 00:33:52,096 I brought you those groceries. 763 00:33:52,096 --> 00:33:54,409 And she said, "Oh no, 764 00:33:54,409 --> 00:33:57,910 the Lord brought those to me 765 00:33:57,910 --> 00:34:03,762 even if he has to use the devil to do it." 766 00:34:03,762 --> 00:34:07,462 (incomplete thought) 767 00:34:07,462 --> 00:34:10,320 But you don't need to know 768 00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:14,096 the means by which it will come. 769 00:34:14,096 --> 00:34:16,303 You can exhaust your own thinking 770 00:34:16,303 --> 00:34:17,918 and your own resources, 771 00:34:17,918 --> 00:34:19,050 and you can rule out - 772 00:34:19,050 --> 00:34:20,992 well, it's not going to happen this way; 773 00:34:20,992 --> 00:34:23,763 it's not going to happen that way. 774 00:34:23,763 --> 00:34:25,726 I've told this story before, 775 00:34:25,726 --> 00:34:27,420 but I got to a certain place 776 00:34:27,420 --> 00:34:30,607 where we had gotten into some degree 777 00:34:30,607 --> 00:34:34,379 of debt over a vehicle that we bought. 778 00:34:34,379 --> 00:34:36,195 And I did in the past 779 00:34:36,195 --> 00:34:38,984 what I would not recommend anybody do now 780 00:34:38,984 --> 00:34:40,704 with regards to a vehicle. 781 00:34:40,704 --> 00:34:42,185 There was a reason I did it, 782 00:34:42,185 --> 00:34:45,183 because I had like $3,500 on a GM card 783 00:34:45,183 --> 00:34:47,750 and it was probably the 784 00:34:47,750 --> 00:34:53,028 worst automobile mistake I made in my life. 785 00:34:53,028 --> 00:34:55,829 But I got into some debt over that van, 786 00:34:55,829 --> 00:34:57,212 and then Ruby had started 787 00:34:57,212 --> 00:34:58,613 her cheesecake business. 788 00:34:58,613 --> 00:35:00,056 And I just asked the Lord, 789 00:35:00,056 --> 00:35:01,552 Lord, would You please allow us 790 00:35:01,552 --> 00:35:03,547 to be out of debt by the end of the year? 791 00:35:03,547 --> 00:35:06,612 And suddenly, anonymous checks 792 00:35:06,612 --> 00:35:09,533 for $1500, $2000 started showing up 793 00:35:09,533 --> 00:35:11,314 in the mail. 794 00:35:11,314 --> 00:35:15,269 And we were going to my mom's at Christmas 795 00:35:15,269 --> 00:35:18,056 and I got almost all the debt paid off, 796 00:35:18,056 --> 00:35:21,452 except for about $1500. 797 00:35:21,452 --> 00:35:23,615 We're going to be heading out of town, 798 00:35:23,615 --> 00:35:26,995 so I won't be able to check the mail anymore. 799 00:35:26,995 --> 00:35:28,075 And I thought, 800 00:35:28,075 --> 00:35:30,682 Ruby, I just want to check the church mail. 801 00:35:30,682 --> 00:35:32,145 All the checks up to that time 802 00:35:32,145 --> 00:35:33,348 had come to my home. 803 00:35:33,348 --> 00:35:35,466 I thought, let's just check the church mail 804 00:35:35,466 --> 00:35:37,326 because we're going to be out of town 805 00:35:37,326 --> 00:35:38,810 for two weeks - to make sure 806 00:35:38,810 --> 00:35:42,139 there's not a backlog in the P.O. box. 807 00:35:42,139 --> 00:35:44,869 And there was a letter for me. 808 00:35:44,869 --> 00:35:46,771 And it perfectly paid off 809 00:35:46,771 --> 00:35:47,919 and got me out of debt. 810 00:35:47,919 --> 00:35:49,320 And then I started thinking, 811 00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:51,184 you know if those checks keep coming, 812 00:35:51,184 --> 00:35:53,066 now that I'm out of debt, 813 00:35:53,066 --> 00:35:55,356 they never kept coming. 814 00:35:55,356 --> 00:35:56,651 It was all over. 815 00:35:56,651 --> 00:35:59,622 Nobody else knew. 816 00:35:59,622 --> 00:36:02,019 Nobody human knew 817 00:36:02,019 --> 00:36:03,535 that I had asked the Lord - 818 00:36:03,535 --> 00:36:06,810 and every time one of those would come in, 819 00:36:06,810 --> 00:36:09,145 I remember putting them out 820 00:36:09,145 --> 00:36:10,516 on the dining room table 821 00:36:10,516 --> 00:36:12,293 and calling all the children around. 822 00:36:12,293 --> 00:36:14,436 Children, look. 823 00:36:14,436 --> 00:36:20,698 Daddy prayed and look what the Lord did. 824 00:36:20,698 --> 00:36:22,454 OK. 825 00:36:22,454 --> 00:36:24,736 Any other thoughts?